LIV Golf (Saudi PIF), "Mergers," and More

[mcanadiens]

The real mind-blowing thing is they way the Saudis are absolutely setting money on fire here. It's one thing when markets exist to pay athletes these amounts. This is different. 

I know the whole deal was never really about making money, but I'd be a bit upset if I were a citizen of Saudi Arabia. Three-years worth of John Rahm could have helped accomplish a lot of the nonsense that PIF puts on its webpage. 

 

[iacas]

8 hours ago, saevel25 said:

Just looked this up, he's made 434.9 million over his career. He made 44 million last year.  Unless Rahm signed a 20 year deal or something, this is just stupid money that LIV is throwing around. I am not sure what else in the contract, how much is guaranteed, or maybe a lot of that is pro-rated winnings. Still, just stupid.

Okay, so the $600M (or $567 or $500 or whatever) is more than Lebron will make, but not the $300M.

50 minutes ago, mcanadiens said:

I know the whole deal was never really about making money, but I'd be a bit upset if I were a citizen of Saudi Arabia.

It is eventually. It's an investment fund.

[Vinsk]

LIV will do to golf what Elon has done for Twitter.

[iacas]

 

[saevel25]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Okay, so the $600M (or $567 or $500 or whatever) is more than Lebron will make, but not the $300M.

Yea, I posted the Lebron money because I thought he would have made more over his career. 

For more context. 

Patrick Mahomes has a 450 million contract. 

Forbes has a top-10 highest paid athlete (which includes off the field earnings, but they split it). 

Ronaldo: 45 million / year
Messi: 65 million / year
Mbappe': 100 million / year
Lebron: 44.5 million / year
Dustin Johnson: 102 million / year
Phil Mickelson: 104 million / year

If Rahm's deal is 567 million, it is probably for 5 years. Which would put him at 113 million / year. Which makes sense if the market value for him is more than DJ and Phil. Which makes absolutely no sense in terms of sports popularity and actual sport athlete value. 

Football "Soccer" is the most popular sport in the world, so that makes more sense. 

 

[iacas]

16 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

If Rahm's deal is 567 million, it is probably for 5 years.

Supposedly three.

[jsgolfer]

It will be mildly interesting to see how the ratings numbers will be after spending a bucket of cash for Rahm.  LIV ratings weren't all that great last year and will Rahm really move the needle that much upwards. 

I'm not sure I'd even watch an LIV event if it had the top 48 players in the world rankings every couple of weeks. Watching the same guys, play for buckets of cash, in a goofy golf format, that has no cut, is just not that interesting.

[GolfLug]

2 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

The real mind-blowing thing is they way the Saudis are absolutely setting money on fire here. It's one thing when markets exist to pay athletes these amounts. This is different. 

I know the whole deal was never really about making money, but I'd be a bit upset if I were a citizen of Saudi Arabia. Three-years worth of John Rahm could have helped accomplish a lot of the nonsense that PIF puts on its webpage. 

 

This is money well spent. From my perspective, when an individual of Rahm's image thinks it is fine to collude with the Saudis, it is hard to overstate the severity of the blow to our collective psyche. 

It doesn't matter how lame the actual golf is. They continue being in the news. They continue winning players we deem to have conscience. This is how normalizing of what was once unacceptable works IMHO.

Edited December 8, 2023 by GolfLug

[snapfade]

I'm just waiting on the LIV flagsticks to be replaced with stripper poles, then I'll watch.

[mcanadiens]

4 hours ago, GolfLug said:

This is money well spent. From my perspective, when an individual of Rahm's image thinks it is fine to collude with the Saudis, it is hard to overstate the severity of the blow to our collective psyche. 

It doesn't matter how lame the actual golf is. They continue being in the news. They continue winning players we deem to have conscience. This is how normalizing of what was once unacceptable works IMHO.

Is it really though?

Surely it sucks for pro golf fans to watch these guys sign with LIV, but if spending all this money is purely sportswashing, is it really producing results?  Rahm takes his money and plays on the has-been team circuit. May as well of retired and taken up shuffleboard. It's big news in the golf world, but did anyone else even notice? 

I guess it is hard to quantify whether people's attitudes toward Saudi Arabia have actually softened. I'm not really seeing it here. 

 

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by mcanadiens

[mdl]

5 hours ago, jsgolfer said:

I'm not sure I'd even watch an LIV event if it had the top 48 players in the world rankings every couple of weeks. Watching the same guys, play for buckets of cash, in a goofy golf format, that has no cut, is just not that interesting.

I agree the current format isn't great. But if it weren't so poisoned by being like the Leni Riefenstahl content for the rulers of Saudi with their medieval values, I could totally get into the team aspect of it. Like, imagine a new PGA with teams where, say, half the tournaments each year are team only – as in no individual prizes – with 4 rounds and cuts and varying formats: total team score, best ball team score, team match play brackets, alternate shot, hell even a scramble or shamble! And then the other half of the tournaments are of the traditional, current PGAT format. That would be super fun!

[jxdama]

MSN

"Wells Fargo, which has sponsored the PGA Tour’s annual event in Charlotte, North Carolina, since 2011, will discontinue its partnership with the tour after the 2024 season, according to Erik Spanberg of the Charlotte Business Journal.

The Financial Services company wanted to stay on as a sponsor beyond 2024, but did not want to commit to the rising financial costs that the PGA Tour demanded, per Josh Carpenter of Sports Business Journal.

That, of course, is a direct result of LIV Golf, and the endless sum of money that the Saudi Public Investment Fund (PIF) has in its vaults.

The PIF has over $700 billion in assets, whereas the PGA Tour is a $1 billion not-for-profit."

 

 

The  best  course  of action for the  PGA now  is to make a  deal with LIV and  move  on.

[guitarget]

Erik, please consider adding a "Wow" icon to reactions to posts.  Sometimes that's all I can come up with, is "wow."

[Missouri Swede]

[Bob M]

I have to admit to never having been a big fan of Rahm's and I wasn't really sure why.....until now.

[Vinsk]

2 hours ago, jxdama said:

That, of course, is a direct result of LIV Golf, and the endless sum of money that the Saudi Public Investment Fund (PIF) has in its vaults

I did read an article stating this is actually over assumed. It mentioned how many previous investments in the billions have come up short. That ‘Utopia’ deal, IIRC, was one that was mentioned. Apparently the PIF has been quite liberal in pouring out large sums of money to where SA was starting to tighten the reins a bit on this outpouring.

[turtleback]

9 hours ago, iacas said:

Okay, so the $600M (or $567 or $500 or whatever) is more than Lebron will make, but not the $300M.

It is eventually. It's an investment fund.

How does a guy have $57 million in career earnings, plus endorsements, and only have an estimated net worth of $25 million?

[chspeed]

10 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

but I'd be a bit upset if I were a citizen of Saudi Arabia

Their public face is a joke. PIF is basically a private fund for the royal family and its friends. Citizens of SA have no say nor the freedom to complain about its investments.

 

9 hours ago, iacas said:

It is eventually. It's an investment fund.

Right. And I wouldn't be surprised if ten years down the road, it will end up being a very good investment. Say what you want about PIF (I do 😉 ), they're not dumb.

 

9 hours ago, Vinsk said:

LIV will do to golf what Elon has done for Twitter.

Hope not! Golf is stronger than Twitter. 💪

7 hours ago, GolfLug said:

This is money well spent.

Agreed. Especially if you buy the argument that they did this for negotiation leverage. One of the strategies discussed in this good Athletic article:

Miller: Jon Rahm is going to LIV. Golf will be different now

---

Rahm, the 2023 Masters champion, will reportedly receive more than a half-billion dollars to leave the PGA Tour.