PGA Tour's 2020 Pace of Play Changes

[iacas]

PGA Tour to create list focusing on slowest players for pace-of play-improvement, according to sources - Golf Digest

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Quote

The PGA Tour confirmed that the policy board “has approved a number of modifications to the Pace of Play Policy.” While not all of the details have been revealed, Golf Digest has learned a few key aspects, including that the tour is moving away from a group-based system to one that focuses on individual players.

Quote

The focus will result in the creation of a list, another source confirmed, of the slowest players—those who repeatedly average more than 45 seconds to play a shot. The list would not be made public, not even to the membership. But once a player is on the list, he is more likely to be timed by a rules official and would incur a one-stroke penalty for a second bad time during a round.

The system goes into effect after the Masters in 2020.

[HJJ003]

I voted some. They will make an example a person or two just to be able to have something to point at and say "see we are doing something", but with no transparency on this so called list I don't see how this will have any major impact. Also- I think the people they penalize will not be anyone that is a household name...

[ChetlovesMer]

Interesting approach. 
Without it being made public, however, I'm not sure we will really know how much affect it will have. I will say, I'd be surprised if anyone gets a stroke penalty more than once. 

[rehmwa]

I like they focus on the individuals, not the groups, but there's a lot of potential overlap there to figure out.  If it's not absolutely clearly one person, the whole group needs to watch closely to see who contributes and who is trying to keep up.

Your second quote that a player is on a list...I'm not a fan of that.  The card is signed off after a round.  A single round.  So what a person does the previous round, or previous 10 rounds, or a career prior to that round shouldn't be a factor in a penalty.  time them all - no cherry picking.  If a player has a pattern of behavior, then the tour should be digging at the player outside of any single round of a single tournament.

 

Seems like PR - I'll believe it if we see evidence of unbiased but equal and prompt enforcement.

[ChetlovesMer]

I don't think the tournament running slower on the PGA is the biggest issue for PGA's slow play. I think the PGA could easily handle that with adjusting start times, or television times etc... 
 

For my money the biggest issue when the PGA players play slow is the knuckle heads watching on their couch. They get up, head to their local course and follow the same procedures. I don't have a great solution for this, but I'd like to see the PGA adopt a slow play rule which "teaches" the folks at home that analyzing everything from the position of the sun, to the dew on the grass, to how often an Africa Butterfly farts, before hitting your damned putt just isn't acceptable. 

[Missouri Swede]

1 hour ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I'd like to see the PGA adopt a slow play rule which "teaches" the folks at home that analyzing everything from the position of the sun, to the dew on the grass, to how often an Africa Butterfly farts, before hitting your damned putt just isn't acceptable. 

de-dechambeau?

or just de-chambeau?

[Double Mocha Man]

57 minutes ago, Missouri Swede said:

de-dechambeau?

or just de-chambeau?

Duh-Chambeau.

[colin007]

DeChamblows

 

Anyways, if they allowed JB Holmes eight minutes to hit a layup, then nothing is going to happen. 

[Missouri Swede]

I think we’re well on our way to making the list right here. The list won’t have to be made public, because it will be crowdsourced. 

[turtleback]

Has Kevin Na cleaned up his act or is he one of the likely ones to be on the list.   And if the latter, do you think that played any part in Tiger not selecting him?

[Vinsk]

17 minutes ago, turtleback said:

Has Kevin Na cleaned up his act or is he one of the likely ones to be on the list.   And if the latter, do you think that played any part in Tiger not selecting him?

Na actually did a pretty good job of speeding his pace. I like him better for it. He acknowledged it and made an effort to change. 

I voted some...make a few examples. And boy oh boy will there be some whining.

[iacas]

6 hours ago, rehmwa said:

Your second quote that a player is on a list...I'm not a fan of that.  The card is signed off after a round.  A single round.  So what a person does the previous round, or previous 10 rounds, or a career prior to that round shouldn't be a factor in a penalty.  time them all - no cherry picking.  If a player has a pattern of behavior, then the tour should be digging at the player outside of any single round of a single tournament.

I am. Penalize the known slow players first.

[dennyjones]

Well dang.   It's not the first time I've stood alone!  It won't be the last.   

I think the players will push the boundaries. I don't believe they will penalize anyone on the PGA tour.   No data to back it up, just a gut feeling.  

[Bonvivant]

I said none. I think with all of the cameras and officials on every hole that they should be held to the rules. 40 seconds max for any player on any shot. 10 second warning from the official (who would have a stopwatch) and a 1 stroke penalty on the first, second, and third offenses. After that they should be DQed. Strict? Yes. Unreasonable? Well that is the rule. Too bad so sad.

[boogielicious]

13 hours ago, colin007 said:

DeChamblows

 

Anyways, if they allowed JB Holmes eight minutes to hit a layup, then nothing is going to happen. 

[Patch]

I not much of a tv watching fan of the pga. I will watch 2 of the 4 majors, and tid bits of everything else the networks televise. I am a " golf should be played, not watched" kind of a guy. 

However, I did read the four options. I was torn between the second, and third voting points. I settled on #2. 

Seems to me that penalizing a guy for being slow could negetively impact their earning ability. These are independent contractors out there trying to make a living. They are still considered independent contractors, right? Is the pga exempt from the various right to work laws? Could a player sue the pga for discrimination, and loss of income? Could a golf equipment manufacturer cry foul because the pga, per their rules, made their sponsored player look bad, which in turn looks bad for their equipment?

 Can this 45 second rule eventually turn into a can of worms? 

They put 140+/- number of golfers on the course, who I presume the pga wants them all to play their best golf for competitive value for their sponsors, advertisers, and home audience. Take a pro golfer out of his/her (?) comfort zone, and they wouldn't play as well as they can. I also realize a slower player can hurt another, faster player's ability to play better. Either way, the competitive value suffers to some extent. 

My fix for pga slow players would be this; Once a player has been identified as a slow player, send these slower players out last in the tournament. This would let them play at their own speed, without bothering the faster players. Their score is their actual score, and not impacted by penalties by others. Also, since they are at the back of the group, they would have little, if any impact on the tv schedule, or the on course spectators.

Is it written in stone some where that the tournament leaders have to be last groups playing on Saturday/Sunday?

Edited November 23, 2019 by Patch

[Missouri Swede]

1 hour ago, Patch said:

My fix for pga slow players would be this; Once a player has been identified as a slow player, send these slower players out last in the tournament.

And so that takes care of Thursday.

On Friday, the tee order is reversed, then you’ve got the opposite problem.

Or do you want to change that as well, to accommodate those who refuse to play In compliance with Rule 5.6?

[Double Mocha Man]

47 minutes ago, Missouri Swede said:

And so that takes care of Thursday.

On Friday, the tee order is reversed, then you’ve got the opposite problem.

Or do you want to change that as well, to accommodate those who refuse to play In compliance with Rule 5.6?

Send 'em to POP University.  Until they graduate with honors they don't get to play.

I hear their football team plays a "hurry-up" offense.

Edited November 23, 2019 by Double Mocha Man